Péllo Walker first discovered the Enneagram in a Helen Palmer-led workshop. He has since used this powerful tool, both personally and professionally, for the last 30 years. I could really feel Péllo’s Type 8 style come through in this interview. He uses his boundless energy as a leader of his company, Daily Digital Imaging, as well as participating on a number of boards and in mentorship roles. I enjoyed learning how many of his roles now resemble activities associated with Enneagram Type 2, along the Type 8’s path of integration.
[Video Transcript]
Matt Schlegel:
Thanks for joining me in conversations with leaders who are using the Enneagram as a leadership tool and a tool for personal growth and development. Today, I’m speaking with Péllo Walker, President of Daily Digital Imaging. Péllo’s been using the Enneagram for nearly 30 years now and he shares his journey of becoming a more self-aware leader. Now for the conversation.
Matt Schlegel:
I’m delighted to be speaking today Péllo Walker, President of Daily Digital Imaging, not only does Péllo apply his boundless energy towards delivering creative marketing solutions for his customers, he also loves public speaking, mentoring other leaders and serving as a board member for a number of organizations.
Matt Schlegel:
I’ve known Péllo for 15 years, but it wasn’t until recently that we discovered our shared passion for using the Enneagram as a leadership tool. I’m eager to learn more about how Péllo uses the Enneagram, both with his team and with the leaders who he mentors. Péllo, thank you so much for joining me today.
Péllo Walker:
Thank you, Matt. I appreciate the opportunity. It’s an honor and a pleasure.
Matt Schlegel:
Oh, lovely. My first question for you is, how and when did you first discover the Enneagram?
Péllo Walker:
It was 1994. It was a live panel of nine different Enneagram points, over an entire weekend with Helen Palmer, who was facilitating it. What do I mean by a panel? We would have an audience, probably about 300 people in the audience. Up on a stage, a raised stage, there were 8 to 10 chairs and then the facilitator.
Péllo Walker:
They would do Point One, Point 2, Point Three, but they didn’t go necessarily in order, they went in different orders that made sense to her and how it made sense to present to us, the audience, who mostly didn’t know anything about it. Some of us did. I did not. It was 1994, it was in Mill Valley, California. I remember it to this day, as if it was yesterday, it changed my life. It changed the way that I looked at the world and more importantly, it changed how I looked at myself. That was huge.
Matt Schlegel:
It’s such a powerful way to learn the Enneagram when you see the different points up on the stage. You see them acting in their typneness and things just start to click in our brain. It’s like, “Oh, I understand that. Oh, I understand that.” Yeah, that is a very powerful way to first come to the Enneagram. Just really resonates. When you went through that, what was the thing that you discovered about yourself that you didn’t know before?
Péllo Walker:
There’s so much, that’s a pretty loaded question. What it felt like was, you see one of those big bank vaults with cash on the other side and they show a photograph inside of the big, huge tumblers. There’s super precision and all these things have to fit together or the Vault’s not opening, because it has multiple lock points.
Péllo Walker:
It was like the whole puzzle, the whole combination came together, click, click, click, click and my life was forever different. Because it wasn’t just what I learned about myself, it was the subtypes. Self preservation, the sexual or social.
Péllo Walker:
I found out that I love food, I belong to the San Francisco Professional Food Society. I’m a member, I’m a gourmet cook. I offer 8 course gourmet suppers for the nonprofits that I sit on that go for thousands of dollars. Very formal, the best of the best.
Péllo Walker:
I wake up in the morning and my wife says, “You’re thinking about supper, it’s breakfast.” I said, “Yeah.” I didn’t realize that, oh, that’s a preservation, that’s something I’m taking care of. That’s a natural nurturing of myself and anybody who’s in my sphere. That I learned about myself.
Péllo Walker:
The other thing is that I take up a lot of energy and a lot of space and that scares people. That’s off putting to others. I never understood that before. All I knew was my feelings were always being hurt, but I didn’t know it was my feelings. I just got angry and I didn’t understand it until after I saw the panel.
Péllo Walker:
I realized, “Oh, I’m really hurt.” Now, I’m talking to you right now with all the cycles around the sun, going back 1994 forward. So, this isn’t something that I could have articulated in 1994. I just knew in my head, “Ah, something’s different about my emotions or it’s misplaced, but I didn’t know what it was. I didn’t know how to articulate it.
Péllo Walker:
Now, I could articulate it as easily as ordering breakfast, but it wasn’t easy. Because, for me, I’m an American high school football player. I’m at 300-log scuba dives, river rafting guy, military guy. That’s all vulnerable stuff. Masculinity’s big in the conversation in social culture right now. That’s all part of who I am and I realized that has nothing to do with anything.
Péllo Walker:
That changed how I am with others, especially my perception of weak men, whatever that is. Soft, pretty boys, they have had a charmed life. If people can bump up against me and stand my energy, even my dialed-back energy, I have a lot more respect for that person, because I know it takes a lot to be around me or be in relationship with me. I’m very aware and sensitive to that. But again, I couldn’t have told you that in 1994. I mean, this is a relatively new thing, as in the last 10 years, maybe?
Matt Schlegel:
Right. I mean, it’s one of the powerful things about the Enneagram, is that it gives us a vocabulary. With which, once we could start to put these names on these things that we are feeling or we’re going through, once you actually have the words to describe them. Then, it’s really a lot easier for us to understand them and then manage them.
Matt Schlegel:
It sounds like that’s what you went through. Understanding that a lot of what is at the core of the 8 is that feeling of vulnerability and how you manifest that feeling into that outward energy. Often anger, to make sure that that vulnerable person inside is taken care of, right?
Péllo Walker:
Yeah. Protected, right?
Matt Schlegel:
Yes. You’re protecting that vulnerability in you. That is so powerful, Péllo, that you are able to go through that journey and then just understand, “Ah, that is what is going on inside.” No, I know we could go on all day long, because this is such a great conversation. But, I want to wrap up and just ask, what advice would you give to other leaders of your type? Of Enneagram Type 8?
Péllo Walker:
2 words, be curious, be introspective. Those are 2 simple ideas and they’re hard. If you’re not curious about the other and you’re not introspective about yourself and how you play against the others, vis a vis, that would be the best thing that you can do. I know that my energy, I can take up the space that I need to take up. I’m going to be the person that I need to be.
Péllo Walker:
I’m not going to sublimate who I am for somebody else’s comfort. I, however, know that I care enough about the other, that I am perfectly willing, on my own, to just dial it down. Or, public speaking, its pace, pause and pitch. So, my pace becomes slower. I take more pauses between words. I soften my voice, so I’m talking softer. So people can have time to bring it in, because I, this 8, I think quickly, I make decisions quickly. I move quickly. I make big-energy movements.
Péllo Walker:
I’m about he’s a military guy, I’m about execution and implementation. I’m a man of action. I want to get something done. Those are measured by behaviors. If behaviors and actions and deeds aren’t followed by what you’re saying, then that’s just a bunch of yak-yak. I know that, as a leader, I have to lead by example. I also have to share where I’m going.
Péllo Walker:
As a leader, it’s my responsibility to provide value for those that are following or to get to buy into to my vision and where they fit into that vision. How I see them fitting into that vision. Otherwise, I’m doing them a disservice and they’re just a thing like a chair. That, I can’t countenance. That’s not fairness. Introspection and be curious, that’s what I would say.
Matt Schlegel:
Yeah, yeah. That is so great. You having that self-awareness of how big you present and how that can be intimidating to others and shut other people down and knowing how to tone that down. You’ve learned that you actually increase the receptivity of others to what you’re saying, when you start to modulate that bigness. That is really great advice, Péllo.
Matt Schlegel:
Thank you again for joining me today and sharing these stories. I am planning on doing and a series on Enneagram and creativity. I know you bring a lot of creativity to the work that you do at Daily Digital Imaging. I would love to have you come back and maybe we could just talk about what it means to be creative from the 8 perspective.
Péllo Walker:
I’d be happy to do that. Be an honor and a privilege. It might be interesting to have several 8s or several of one, sorry. Anyway, it’s just-
Matt Schlegel:
All right. Yeah, yeah. I could see that creative juice already flowing.
Péllo Walker:
Sorry, sorry. Sorry. I apologize.
Matt Schlegel:
Don’t be, don’t be. All right, Péllo.
Péllo Walker:
All right.
Matt Schlegel:
Well, thank you again. I really appreciate it.
Péllo Walker:
Thank you, Matt. I appreciate it. Thank you for the time. It’s an honor and a privilege and it’s been my pleasure.
Matt Schlegel:
Thanks. Thanks for watching. I could really feel Péllo bring out his powerful Type 8 style in our conversation. Earlier in his career, Péllo had been in roles and situations where he was encouraged to bring that powerful style out. It wasn’t until later, especially when he became a leadership mentor, that he appreciated the value of adopting a different approach. Maybe a quieter, more receptive approach when working with other types.
Matt Schlegel:
This really reminds me of an 8 moving along the path of integration to more Type 2-like behavior. It was great that Péllo was able to share that story. If you found this helpful, please click on the thumbs-up button, subscribe to the channel and get notifications of future episodes. If you have any questions, please leave them in the comments and I’ll get to them as soon as possible. Thanks again.
Leave a Reply